Big money spender

Nath wrote:... in a game that has 100 MAX players?

You'll be surprized:


Note that it's stats from ladder. Most players nave no account on the ladder.

FireBall wrote:...

Most of what you said is fair enough, but when you dont follow the rules you helped to implement it's "absurd". For over a month you've harassed me to play cm vs you, when I've made it clear in an unmentionable amount of times I wont play you, and of recollection "Harassment" is one of the rules. And I had Anette clarify this aswell, if I believe you are harassing me you have to stop or get muted banned? So I'll like to say this formally on the forum. I will not play vs you, end of discussion. Stop asking/harassing me about it or I will add screenshots of next time to the 10+ list I already have. Thanks.

keta wrote:...

*Double Post*

I meant the "professional" players as it were on EU RS servers.

Nath wrote:I meant the "professional" players as it were on EU RS servers.

I can't see the difference between "professional" and normal players.

keta wrote:

Nath wrote:I meant the "professional" players as it were on EU RS servers.

I can't see the difference between "professional" and normal players.

Yet you dare go exclaiming that people play only smg.

/offtopic

keta wrote:

Nath wrote:I meant the "professional" players as it were on EU RS servers.

I can't see the difference between "professional" and normal players.

I can't see why you need an in-depth analysis into it, I meant people who play on RS servers in my previous statements. Nothing else needs to be said about it.

Nath wrote:

FireBall wrote:...

Most of what you said is fair enough, but when you dont follow the rules you helped to implement it's "absurd". For over a month you've harassed me to play cm vs you, when I've made it clear in an unmentionable amount of times I wont play you, and of recollection "Harassment" is one of the rules. And I had Anette clarify this aswell, if I believe you are harassing me you have to stop or get muted banned? So I'll like to say this formally on the forum. I will not play vs you, end of discussion. Stop asking/harassing me about it or I will add screenshots of next time to the 10+ list I already have. Thanks.

Ahahahaha Nath harassed xD you and your childish games. I do believe that it was you saying somewhere in Cinc's log that I don't have the guts to ask you for cm in the absence of Adm. Funny how 30 mins ago I asked you for cm without Adm and you come here feeling all harassed and whatnot xD. You just don't know what else to come up with lol. Have no worries, I won't insist on the matter.

FireBall wrote:Have no worries, I won't insist on the matter.

Thank you.

Nath wrote:I can't see why you need an in-depth analysis into it, I meant people who play on RS servers in my previous statements. Nothing else needs to be said about it.

OK. Every player, even elite one, may play on public servers. Some, the "elite ones", may play on passworded servers, too. It's a privilege, not a right. And I can't see logic path from 'I have password' to 'I should have right to choose admin'. There still no difference between your voice and voice of 700 other unnamed babos. Most of players just play, and everything is OK for them. The ones who are always in the heart of drama isn't majority, if we are still talking about democracy here.

keta wrote:...

A very high majority of people who play on public either dont know this forum exsists, or don't use it anyway. And concerning administration towards everyone it was fine before, public administration is mainly Flamespawn, Insults and maybe hackers every now and then. I was talking about RS players as for THIS CONVERSATION is aimed at who have been muted or "removed from server list", and every case that this conversation relates to are RS players.

keta wrote:OK. Every player, even elite one, may play on public servers. Some, the "elite ones", may play on passworded servers, too. It's a privilege, not a right. And I can't see logic path from 'I have password' to 'I should have right to choose admin'. There still no difference between your voice and voice of 700 other unnamed babos. Most of players just play, and everything is OK for them. The ones who are always in the heart of drama isn't majority, if we are still talking about democracy here.

There's no difference between my voice and voice of 700 unnamed babos? And tell me now, to whom does this game matter more, to me who have been playing for over 3 years and been trying to make it better, or to a player who discovered some exe file named bv2 on his pc yesterday and decided to run it to see what it is?

You're also wrong, the access to rs servers isn't a privilege, it's a right. But it should be a privilege, though each attempt to make it one (new passwords, using the friendlist) fails in the end.

Same text again, revised:

Every player, even elite one, may act as a bitch on public servers. Some, the "elite ones", may act so on passworded servers, too. On public servers players getting muted or banned, sometimes even globally, for abusing the rules. I can't imagine why actions should differ for RS servers? (btw, in Soviet Russia admin actions are applied on all servers at once) Most players just play on public or RS servers, and everything is OK for them. The ones who are always in the heart of drama isn't majority of players. They are even isn't majority of RS players (you may count them by yourself to check if I'm wrong).

Man has a point. But I feel this discussion isn't going anywhere really apart from the fact that you have strayed from the actual topic, so feel free to post your thoughts here https://eurobabo.forumotion.com/t1712-the-rules

get it over with, you're all fucking wussies

Since I don't really know anything about the individual cases there's controversy about right now, I'll just end my contribution by saying that it's slightly worrying that the people suddenly getting hit by these 'new rules' are the personal enemies of the head admin. We'll see later if the connection persists, I guess.


DISCLAIMER:
The rest of this post is, objectively speaking, just me not being able to resist answering the weak arguments that were made towards my post, which FB doesn't even seem to have read before responding.
/end disclaimer

FireBall wrote:So nobody should be admin and the community should just run itself, riiiight.

I don't think you read my post..? I have no idea where you got the idea that I didn't want there to be any admins in the game. I stated that neither you, cinc, or varlan should be admins - or other controversional persons.

FireBall wrote:Regarding old admins, you know why there haven't been any controversies (and that's not entirely true) connected with them? Because "older" players were never really scrutinized for outrageous behavior, which in turn is why we have come to this situation where a player can be racist, offensive, can basically say anything he wants without consequences.

I'm politically involved here in getting rid of racism, its definately something people should just get straight up banned for. You might be right about people not getting punished before, I don't know because I haven't actually seen it happen. If I did I'd be upset and probably shouting for more severe punishments too.

FireBall wrote: Also to your point of not having a head admin, I think plenty of us remember how Insomnia and NbZ admins banned themselves over a cm.

Again, not sure if you actually read my post. It's fairly clear that I'm arguing for a non-controversional person to be head admin, instead of you. Not that there wouldnt be anyone at all. You missed the point completely.

As to the off topic part of your sentence (this really has nothing to do with wanting to have another head admin from the team since neither Uli nor Bull is on it), I was of course aware that you might bring it up.
Instead of angling it towards "nbz and insomnia admins" (implying for example that Anette, Gloom, memento or neo were involved in it, which they werent), you should have said that it was Bullet and Ulisses who started banning eachother. Taking one individual's fault and attributing it to their whole team, (or their country, or their ethniticity... and so on) is never a very good idea... right?
I'm not arguing for either of these two persons to be head admin. I was talking about people who are on the team now.

There are several people on the admin team who have been admins for a long time and there have been little or no controversies connected with them.

I agree with nath (probably first time ever) on running a fair poll.
Just take the actual admin list and ask people which of them really deserves to be there.
Then, act accordingly.
Simple.

Guys, again, you're making nice backdoor for some people. Until there's admins, there's always people who don't like that admins. If you think it's possible to change current admins by voting, and if current admin team will be spineless enough to let you do that, pretty soon some persons will realize (come on, they are already realized) that it's clearly possible to provoke any admin, start to shout that he's actions is personal, and kick him out from the admin team.

The only Fire's fault is that he's sure that rules are the same for everyone, but some think that rules should slightly differ for them. But, surprisingly, Fire is rignt, and 'some' are wrong.

As a last note, voting can't be fair until huje majority will vote. Current admin system grants to an admin rights for the public servers and RS ones at the same time. You want to change admin? Well, you should find some people who are ready to vote, and who will represent majority, not 30 people. Damn, every drama, every "THINGS NEEED TO BE CHANGEEEEEED" shout comes from the same people again and again. They can be counted on the fingers of one hand. Why should community adapt to this... erm... ambiguous people? Who've chosen you?

keta wrote:Guys, again, you're making nice backdoor for some people. Until there's admins, there's always people who don't like that admins. If you think it's possible to change current admins by voting, and if current admin team will be spineless enough to let you do that, pretty soon some persons will realize (come on, they are already realized) that it's clearly possible to provoke any admin, start to shout that he's actions is personal, and kick him out from the admin team.

The only Fire's fault is that he's sure that rules are the same for everyone, but some think that rules should slightly differ for them. But, surprisingly, Fire is rignt, and 'some' are wrong.

As a last note, voting can't be fair until huje majority will vote. Current admin system grants to an admin rights for the public servers and RS ones at the same time. You want to change admin? Well, you should find some people who are ready to vote, and who will represent majority, not 30 people. Damn, every drama, every "THINGS NEEED TO BE CHANGEEEEEED" shout comes from the same people again and again. They can be counted on the fingers of one hand. Why should community adapt to this... erm... ambiguous people? Who've chosen you?

Ketamine, do I really need to say it over and over? People to whom this game matters have been involved in every vote. If you really wanna make a difference instead of complaining here, put an announcement on the ladder site whenever an important vote is being made, I'll be glad to put the poll on some other site so that people don't have to register to vote.

Also, you're wrong if you think nothing needs to be changed. Like I said many times and I'll say it again: Babo community doesn't stand still. Sooner or later it becomes obvious that a change is needed. And I haven't seen any negative change done so far. Nadespawn is gone, ft is at range 3 (although I voted for 3.5 here), dmg is at 0.13 damage, cg at 0.143, and I don't remember if there were any other changes. Now, I dare you to look at them and call them all bad decisions.

And to address the first part of your post: In 3.5 years I've been playing, I've never seen any provocation or controversy with most admins. Exceptions are Fosters, Uli, Neo, Bull, me, varlan and Fire. Guess who's the only one that remains an admin.

Keta, u are wrong. Again. As per usual.
People who voted in the past polls are the ones who really care about the game and the community.
Others who did not vote are not careing enough, or are just fine with the decisions made by your 30 people.
Still, if it doesn't fit ur needs, please SPECIFY THE MINIMUM NUMBER OF VOTES required to make a poll VALID (I already asked Anette about the same argument and had no SPECIFIC reply) or, please, stop complaining about votes amount.

As a side note :
POLLS = DEMOCRACY
NO POLLS = DICTATORSHIP
No matter who the heck owns the servers/forums/etc, they can be still democratic or dictatorial as their preference.

GrenD wrote:etc

You must understand that the basis of your entire argument is wrong. You rely on the fact that I am punishing my personal enemies. Didn't I just prove that this is a lie? I believe I did, the fact that you choose to hang on to this proves that you don't have a case. Now read carefully:

FireBall wrote:

Nath wrote:. Banning and muting everyone who crosses his (Or any other admins) path is ridiculous

Actually what you've just said is ridiculous. Here is why: Pira got removed/muted for all the things he said to Uber(and his situation was discussed and agreed upon on the admin section), Cinc got muted for approximately 7 minutes for talking during the cm after being warned (true I was playing) but what's this? Varlan got muted for insulting Cinc and some other player (I asked a global admin's advice since we all know about the delicate situation between those two and the answer I got was to keep Var muted). So obviously you don't know what you're talking about. Also Pira was removed from friendslist and not banned, he can still play on pubs despite maybe not deserving it, I haven't banned anyone. What you are saying is absurd, if anything I am more objective than anyone else, proof of this being the fact that Varlan now hates on me, everyone knows we used to be friends . This is why I'm actually fit for this, because I treat everyone the same be they friends or not, some people just can't accept that .

Nath wrote:

FireBall wrote:...

Most of what you said is fair enough

See. even your clan mate agrees with me. Once more let me emphasize, Pira is no more my enemy than he is yours. I proved the case with Varlan when I wrote the post about us talking in Romanian, AND Steli confirmed it. As for Cinc, well he's been lying about me since the dawn of babo, yet I took measures to "protect" him as well. If anything I proved that I act indiscriminately which is something every admin should do. Besides it's absurd as well as naive to assume that everyone who gets banned/muted and comes here yelling "admin abuse" is my enemy .

FireBall wrote:Varlan got muted for insulting Cinc and some other player (I asked a global admin's advice since we all know about the delicate situation between those two and the answer I got was to keep Var muted). So obviously you don't know what you're talking about.

You are being misleading. I didn't insult Cinc. What the hell of an insult is "stfu"? Mute me for that? Please... You could be a little more honest in the matter. And that some other player whom I really did insult was a spawn flamer whom you didn't even kick/ban. You really know your stuff.

FireBall wrote:if anything I am more objective than anyone else

Yeah, right...

FireBall wrote:What you are saying is absurd, if anything I am more objective than anyone else, proof of this being the fact that Varlan now hates on me, everyone knows we used to be friends . This is why I'm actually fit for this, because I treat everyone the same be they friends or not, some people just can't accept that .

You're making a laugh of yourself with these statements. : D

1. I don't hate you. This is a stupid thing to say. I am on the other hand very disappointed in you and of your behaviour recently. I don't judge you, but act acordingly. When people were unsatisfied with my prestation as an admin we talked in private after which I stepped back as I wasn't able to fulfill my duties as people expected. Why don't you think about that a bit.

2. You say we used to be friends. That means at some point we started to not be friends anymore. I don't know when that moment occured. Maybe you can tell me.

3. Just by bringing up the issue of friendship you give your self away. It is obvious that this is something personal.

FireBall wrote:
First of all we have the habit of talking dirty or in a vulgar way when we converse in Romanian, simply to have a laugh, never to insult, and it was always mutual, not 1 person cursing the other, and Steli can confirm that. Varlan is just trying to use that with all the other lies he said.

I am not a lier. And you are just a hypocrite and this quote makes me sick. You muted me then you laugh in my face and call me names. Pathetic. Moreover it's would suffice for a ss to appear a curse in it, but you and me both know the context and the manner in which you said it so stop being a pussy and assume what you do. It wasn't ball breaking or whatever you try to imply. And I'm not a lier once again. Stop saying that because I am offended.

GrenD wrote:Right now the forum argument is mostly between controversional people in the community (fb, cinc, varlan). By controversional, I mean there are strong feelings both ways, positive and negative, about them.

Because these people like to argue a lot (or, state their opinions, if youd like a less negative sounding word ), the rest don't usually care enough to get involved, and don't like to support them in one particular argument because they might get drawn into other arguments later.

What we should be able to agree on is that neither of these people should be admin (all of these are or have been in the past as far as I know).
What these people should be able to do is keep expressing their opinions. This new system of muting everyone who talks back is too dictatorial.

I am not admin anymore on most servers. FireBall told me most people/admins don't like the fact that I'm admin and that I should step down. I did. Crapper insisted I should be admin on the pink servers so I accepted. Maybe he should give a hint at least as to why he still wants me in his team of admins.

GrenD wrote:

KingJ suggested that it would be fair for the admins to be able to make a council and decide to elect a new head admin if it is needed (majority voting system).

This system is of course inherently faulty because the head admin picks his team, but atleast we could start off by starting this vote, or if FbZ understands what I'm talking about here, it'd of course be much appreciated if he would step down.

+1

FireBall wrote:
See. even your clan mate agrees with me. Once more let me emphasize, Pira is no more my enemy than he is yours. I proved the case with Varlan when I wrote the post about us talking in Romanian, AND Steli confirmed it. As for Cinc, well he's been lying about me since the dawn of babo, yet I took measures to "protect" him as well. If anything I proved that I act indiscriminately which is something every admin should do. Besides it's absurd as well as naive to assume that everyone who gets banned/muted and comes here yelling "admin abuse" is my enemy .

Dude. You have a serious problem.... You didn't prove shit and you sound exactly like Cinc. And you are yet again trying to avoid the issue at hand. Which is your ill behaviour as an admin, not my mute. I said "fish" - fine mute me. I am guilty. You find that offensive and punishable? Fine punish me. But don't you call me names and act happy for my misery. You enforce rules but you don't play by them. You muted me 1 week for saying "fish" and let a flamespawner unpunished. You mute me for that then you insult me and like a pussy you put a retarded smiley after just so you can have your loophole. Pathetic.




I can see my screenshots have been deleted. Why is that? And why isn't anyone resolve my insult report? FireBall insulted me and no measures are taken.

I don't get why people only go bashing on fire since we (the whole admin team) all agreed that the actions were right and also proofed with evidences and therefore should be made.
Especially in the case of Pira's mute/removal.

Back on topic (Varlan's mute):

Funny how Cinc doesn't say a word about the justification of this mute although it was him who reported Varlan or wanted to see actions taken against him. Instead of supporting this case he prefers creating more drama around Fire.

varlan wrote:I can see my screenshots have been deleted. Why is that?

If you click edit on your post you can see your screens are still there, why they aren't showing must be because of the image host you are using.
see below, your links are still there

Code:

[img]http://s15.postimage.org/bq8lnjz7d/ss190.jpg[/img]

Translation

Big money spender : have fun
Big money spender: looser :P


After telling me I am muted for 1 week on all servers. I don't dispute the mute even if it's pure hatemute or w/e. Instead of banning a flamespawner he muted me but w/e. Mute me on Cinc's demand big boss.

I DO however ask to be unmuted on RS since there I play CM's and being muted there is like being banned [b]and[/b] report Fireball's perpetual admin abuse in the past 1-2 months or so. I guess he has serious problems if he turned from milk to shit in the late period. Or maybe I just don't understand Babo anymore  :suspect: Or maybe he judges me by the tag in front of my name. Glorious in any case.

I am offended when I am called a looser, so, I'm reporting that aswell. Or putting a retarded emoticon after an insult gives you immunity?

GFY: have fun
GFY: nolifer :P

[color=red]*UPDATE*[/color]

[img]http://s16.postimage.org/jneptwr9f/ss191.jpg[/img]

Please stop trying to cause extra drama for no reason.

(about topic, I had written a rather long post, but because of lunch didn't finish it and now there are a lot of new posts, so dunno when/if I am gonna try and write something again)

varlan wrote:I am not admin anymore on most servers. FireBall told me most people/admins don't like the fact that I'm admin and that I should step down. I did. Crapper insisted I should be admin on the pink servers so I accepted. Maybe he should give a hint at least as to why he still wants me in his team of admins.

This is hardly the thread to discuss this Get your lazy ass on msn and I'll tell you

Nova wrote:Funny how Cinc doesn't say a word about the justification of this mute although it was him who reported Varlan or wanted to see actions taken against him. Instead of supporting this case he prefers creating more drama around Fire.

Ok nova, you're protecting fire, perfectly reasonable. Now I'd ask you a question, but I already know your answer:

Is Cinc's mute justified?
Nova's answer: Yes, because he was warned.
(Cinc's answer: No, because he was warned when the cm was not played, and muted on an obviously accidental line)

I'm not supporting varlan's case. I vouched for a mute only on public servers, since he tends to do most of his insults there. To be honest, I've rarely seen him insult people on rs. Also, varlan's mute isn't because he insulted me. I reported him first for insulting another player. The fact that he also told me to stfu 2 times in the meantime probably just added couple of days to his sentence.

Also nova, I never had the intent of creating any more drama, but now that I've seen some comments directed to me personally with some insults implied, here's some drama for you:

Fire, explain to everyone why you removed me from the admin spot, while you're being so mr. above-us-all.